MedioEvo Universalis II: new decks and cards

Genesis and assembling from the first ideas until the creation of the prototype

The cards and the designers

Messaggio da leggereda Veldriss il 3 luglio 2016, 15:10

Now is the moment to tell you how the cards are coming along…obviously I will tell you everything from the beginning so this post will be quite long and written when I have time ;)

The idea of redoing the cards came to me at the end of 2007/beginning of 2008 when the necessity of making my prototype less prototype had arisen (after my first conventions).
The first things that had to be changed were the miniatures which I had “stolen” from other board games, then the box and finally the cards.

The work for the box was easy and there were loads of possibilities, but for the miniatures (armies, transport, goods, fortresses etc.) it was a different thing altogether…not just as far as time was concerned, but also for the money :?:

The cards were even more complicated: if the miniatures had cost me a fortune, for the cards the price seemed even higher :roll:

There was a period when I didn’t feel like spending all this money for a prototype that wasn’t having much success, and the publishing majors didn’t seem interested so I had lost my motivation.

Then I found some motivation and I started looking for a designer who was willing to do the job…I asked here and there…but I could find anybody :evil:

I had asked the company “Crea”, where I print my components, if they knew anybody that would do the job and one of the workers said: I could, if you want.
I explained the work that had to be done and he gave me an initial price…it’s a big sum, but considering the number of cards, it is honest…ok, I will consider it…a year later I returned to make him do a prototype of the card…it wasn’t bad at all :lol: .

I start looking around and during the first months of 2008 I was told of a designer that lives near my house…I contact her, we meet, I show her the work I am thinking about, she shows me some drawings she has done it the past so I can see her style, I give her a copy of the old cards and she tells me a price, we seem to agree on everything, the job has to be started, but she is busy with some other illustrations for another customer…ok…I wait for a couple of months…nothing…another 6 months…nothing…I insist a couple of times, then I give up.

I forget the matter for some months until thanks to Silverwolf (and his “monkey”) I started looking for a designer again through the internet; I posted on various websites…nobody was answering 
Then they suggested I should contact “Mocs” from TdG who seemed to be quite good…I contacted him…he is busy, but we agree to meet to talk about things calmly and face to face at PLAY 2010…it’s a start.
I widen my research and discover an artist here in the Val Camonica, everybody says he’s really good…I meet him and bring all the material to show him what has to be done…the more we talk the more I am convinced I have FINALLY found the right person :D
We then pass to the economic part of the work…he calculates and tells me the price…I can assure you I was petrified…I couldn’t even calculate how much each single card would cost….
It was a cost I could not afford…I think I continued thinking about it for about 3-4 days, 20 times a day…
I even meet a tattoo artist who had a style that was similar to what I had in mind…even this time I was convinced it was the right person, he was very enthusiastic about the project as well.
Unfortunately I realized that a tattoo has nothing to do with the drawing I had in mind…they were great tattoos but there was too little detail compared to the result I had in my mind.

The research went on…but there was a series of: ok, yes, I can do it, ok, I accept…and then they disappeared…even though work opportunities aren’t so easy to find these days…

Here in the valley I discovered another designer, the youngest of all, he is attending a graphic course at university….it’s worth a try, especially as I met him by chance, so that must mean something :P
We meet and I explain the whole idea of the new game cards…when he shows me the first drawings…WOW :D really nice, I really liked the style and the colours.

At the end of all this, I had an idea of styles, colours and prices…and apart from the 12000 euros, the others all had more or less the same prices so…I thought about it and decided to make the investment.

Of the 10-12 people I contacted, only 4 made me a drawing, and here they are:

Nicola Ballarini
Immagine
Immagine

Immagine

Omar Savoldelli
Immagine
Immagine

Nicola Fedriga
Immagine
Immagine
Immagine
Immagine

Considering that I am also called Nicola, there were too many Nicola :lol: :lol:

Now I had to make the final decision: Omar or Nicola Fedriga??
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Some comments from other forums

Messaggio da leggereda Veldriss il 3 luglio 2016, 17:16

Here are some comments from other forums about the designers, I hope the people who commented don’t mind:

"mcuccia
Re: Medioevo Universalis, boardgame prototype - 2010/04/09 20:18
compliments to the designers they are all very good! My doubt would be between omar e nicola!
and compliments to you too
are you looking for players or playtesters at Catania? Contact me!!
http://giochidietrolequinte.blogspot.com
http://mercoludi.blogspot.com
http://www.linkedin.com/in/massimilianocuccia
http://www.facebook.com/massimiliano.cuccia
Massimiliano Cuccia"

"Karl
Re: Medioevo Universalis, boardgame prototype - 2010/04/09 20:27
Omar and Nicola’s are really good.
Could you send me their contacts?
a daniele.karl (AT) gmail.com
Daniele"


"gabryk
Re: Medioevo Universalis, boardgame prototype - 2010/04/09 20:42
WOW!
Omar has more details and is more realistic, I vote for him!
can you give me the contacts too: gabryk91 at hotmail punto com"


"fantavir
Re: Medioevo Universalis, boardgame prototype - 2010/04/10 13:50
mmm…there are 2 Nicola! karl ed mcuccia: who do you mean?
ciao"


"Karl
Re: Medioevo Universalis, boardgame prototype - 2010/04/10 20:39
Nicola...? Fedriga!
I like the vase and the fortress; I don’t the characters and the colours.
I like Omar’s characters, but that’s all there is.
Daniele"


"gabryk
Re: Medioevo Universalis, boardgame prototype - 2010/04/11 07:51
Fedriga, of course.
For the colour it depends what you’re looking for, Fedriga’s drawings are lighter (they remind me of Leonardo Da Vinci’s graphics)probably because of the colour, Omar’s drawings are stylistically better but darker. It dipends in which direction you are going with the graphics of the game”


"mcuccia
Re: Medioevo Universalis, boardgame prototype - 2010/04/12 13:04
Ballarini!I like the strong touches and also Omar!!
Post edited by: mcuccia, at: 2010/04/12 13:05
are you looking for players or playtesters at Catania? Contact me!!
http://giochidietrolequinte.blogspot.com
http://mercoludi.blogspot.com
http://www.linkedin.com/in/massimilianocuccia
http://www.facebook.com/massimiliano.cuccia
Massimiliano Cuccia"


"Rufio
Posted: VUTCVenerdi09Ven, 09 Apr 2010 18:08:03 +0000080303 Subject:
Omar!


"Aiyvann
Posted: VUTCVenerdi09Ven, 09 Apr 2010 18:28:57 +0000285757 Subject:
As I am a fan of the combination china+pencil I would have voted for Ballarini.
But as the challenge is between Omar and Fedriga, I chose the second: I think Omar’s style is very nice but a bit too “cartoon like”.
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THE CARDS: WORK IN PROGRESS

Messaggio da leggereda Veldriss il 3 luglio 2016, 17:19

I thought about it and decided to give the job to Omar Savoldelli…I really liked Nicola Fedriga, but Omar is really into the Middle Ages so he had extra motivation for these drawings.

“Hi Nicola,
As promised I have finished the mercenary.
Here is a version, like a monochromatic drawing on a parchment,
One is coloured normally, the other has a “dirty” effect which makes the image less “cartoon like”, more realistic but with less brighter colours…
Let me know what you think, and which you prefer, maybe we could use the parchment as a starting point for the monochromatic card drawings.
Happy Easter!!!
Omar”
Immagine

After the MERCENARY as a test, we passed to the rest of the “EMPIRE” cards.

This is how I’m working with him, an example with one card so you can get an idea of the work that’s behind it:

1 - first of all I collected images I liked and that could give Omar an idea of what I had in mind, in this case the LEADER.

Immagine

If necessary I add other images, such as the shield for the LEADER or 3-4 crossbows for the CROSSBOWMAN.

Immagine

Then I send Omar a file where I explain my concept of LEADER:

Here are some figures of soldiers that inspire me for the leader
The LEADER should have an “active” pose, as if he’s about to use the sword
Must definitely have sword and shield
The most similar figure is the blue cavalier of 02
No horse of course
Bright colours as in 02 03, but preferably no red, as we use it for the TEMPLAR
The square helmet of 02 is perfect, and also the cross on the face
I added some heraldic coat of arms, you chose the one you prefer for the shield…probably it will depend on which colour you will use for the LEADER.


2 - Omar then sends me a quick sketch to see if I like the result:

Immagine

Hi Nicola,
I prepared the sketches of the 4 characters you left me,
I’m sending them back so you can confirm them before I add other details (…is this possible?).

The leader:

The problem is the shield, our proportion is quite square, and the shield elongates the figure a lot, especially if it’s not on the ground but used.
As I wanted a moving figure, and I didn’t want to cut the weapon (of course) I chose this solution, adding the mantle that minimizes the empty spaces on the sides and avoids the drawing to be too “tall”.
The chest will be covered with a red tunic, with red and yellow decorations, as the templar is going to be all white apart from the red crosses so they won’t be similar at all. Armour on the arms and leather gloves.


Hi Omar
All is fine…
The IMPORTANT thing is to maintain the same proportions for all the characters, so that if for example I put the MERCENARY and the LEADER side by side they are both the same height…THEY MUST ABSOLUTELY be the same size, not 180 and 160, sorry if I insist but it is VERY IMPORTANT.

For the LEADER we could maybe cut the lower part of the shield or see if we can use 3D on the card like I did for the sword handle in the MERCENARY.


Hi Nicola,
Sorry if I’m late answering,
If I understand correctly you want the same proportions for all the characters and this seems reasonable. Different heights wouldn’t have been a problem as the eye would recognize the characters in different scales, but it is definitely more coherent to keep the same proportions at least for cards of the same pack.

I will have to cut the shields, I looked at the cards you are using now and the only one with the shield (the crusader) is cut. They are all up close, which makes it difficult to create certain poses, such as the heroine, but I will find a solution.
Thursday/Friday I will work on it.
Bye.
Omar.


3 - After some emails this is the result:

Immagine

4 - if everything is ok, I confirm and Omar can start colouring.

Hi Nicola,
Here is the finished leader,
And also I tried to put it in the grid, it seems ok, but you decide.
I will now do the crossbowman.
Bye,
Omar


Perfect…a little too coarse maybe, but if I think of all the cards you’re going to do it’s fine.
We will use the blue and pale blue for “calmer” characters, such as the diplomat.

Just do one thing…for safety…look at the old cards and decide more or less what colour they will be, so we won’t have the problem of having too many cards the same colour.

I’ll give you an example, but don’t follow it:
Heroine pale blue
Diplomat blue
Bishop crimson
Killer grey
Thief “I have no idea”
Genie green etc.

Question: can I have the final images not in JPG but in a bigger size (I mean file dimension)
Continue this way, bye
Nicola


Surprise!
As you can see I’m not worried about the colour choice, it took me 10 minutes to change the leader from red to pale blue. I had foreseen this problem so I coloured everything on different levels. Helmet, tunic, mantle and shield on 4 different levels, all red.
Then there are the cross on the helmet, the glove, the club handle, the wood of the club, the metal on the club, the lion on the shield, the armour etc. all on different levels.

I have the images in high resolution, you should pass by with a USB key and pick them up, it’s not a problem. I will start sending you previews, then I will make you a high resolution CD.
Also because I might slightly change the drawings I send you, so at the end in the CD you will have the final versions.


Immagine

This work will be done for all 60 cards…but we have the same ideas and tastes (80-90%), so I like working with Omar…let’s hope all goes well!
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Other comments on the work

Messaggio da leggereda Veldriss il 3 luglio 2016, 17:20

Here are some comments from other forum so you can see how Omar’s work was appreciated:

"PaoLo
Re: Medioevo Universalis, boardgame prototype - 2010/05/06 18:18
WOW!! My compliments to everyone, including Omar!
It’s thanks to these values I can give my imagination some amazing invisible pages that would be ruined if written down!

"Khoril
Re: Medioevo Universalis, boardgame prototype - 2010/05/06 20:45
PaoLo wrote:
WOW!!My compliments to everyone, including Omar!
I subscribe the compliments…wow!

"Claudio77
Re: Medioevo Universalis, boardgame prototype - 2010/05/07 00:02
I also have remained without words, really a wonderful job!
I will remember your name when I finish “XV century” (even though I fear that it will be more difficult to capture the Renaissance spirit…)

"gabryk
Re: Medioevo Universalis, boardgame prototype - 2010/05/07 08:47
really amazing"
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EMPIRE CARDS: THE CROSSBOWMAN

Messaggio da leggereda Veldriss il 3 luglio 2016, 17:21

Basically the CROSSBOWMAN is similar to the MERCENARY.
SAME TYPE OF ARMOUR
SAME COLOURS
NO SHIELD
NO SCARS AND LESS FIERCER LOOK
NO BAG WITH MONEY (of course)
CROSSBOW IN HIS HAND
I put some photos of soldiers with crossbows so you can see it from different angles.
As you can see in photos 05 07 09 the metal ring in front of the crossbow is to put your foot in when you are charging it.
I would like a soldier in position 02 or 08, see which you can do better.


Here is an enlargement of 02 and 08 to give you an idea:
Immagine

Crossbowman:
I wanted to give the crossbowman a different armour.
I was thinking of a leather padded armour, the pose is dynamic, like in the pictures you sent me, just slightly rotated.
No beard/moustache, grey clothing, knife. I wanted to put the quiver with the arrows behind but I think that crossbowmen didn’t keep it on their shoulders like archers, you tell me.


Ok crossbow and armour and clothing, you see if the knife will fit in, but I would definitely put quiver and arrows: http://images.google.it/images?um=1&hl=it&tbs=isch:1&sa=1&q=balestriere&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=&gs_rfai=&start=0
The rest is ok


After the first sketch he did the drawing, we corrected a little something here and there, such as the tilt of the crossbow, the arrows, the tilt of the foot for the loading, here are the steps:
Immagine
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EMPIRE CARDS: THE CARDINAL

Messaggio da leggereda Veldriss il 3 luglio 2016, 17:26

The cardinal is better, but if we can’t find it, we will use the bishop.
I found this:
Immagine
And these:
http://www.google.it/images?q=cardinale+medioevo&um=1&hl=it&tbs=isch:1&ndsp=21&imgtype=i_similar&sa=X&ei=RJb-S7OQC5yImwOr_-ykDA&ct=img-sim-l&oi=image_sil&resnum=14&tbnid=m2Gt3Iz-10BsAM:
As you can see they are similar…the red hat is the official one, red mantle and white tunic underneath


Cardinal: I would draw a chubby figure, in this drawing the expression isn’t menacing, but in the final one I want it to be like the Pope, a menacing and astute look.

Cardinal ok, the ring on the right hand mustn’t be too visible
The haircut seems too simple, like a peasant.
[I thought “hands together with fingers crossed on the stomach (or one hand over the other so you don’t go crazy with all the fingers”) but this is better, if the hands were different he would seem in a static pose, and that’s not Ok


As usual we think alike, so that’s ok.
While I was reading your notes on the cardinal’s hands I thought: no, he appears too pensive like that… it’s better with the hands on the stomach… then I read the rest… :)


Hi Nicola,
I’m sending you assassin, relic and cardinal all coloured.
I sent you the cardinal “work in progress” because I put a chair in (I think it is necessary), and I wanted to know what you think about it…I wanted to be sure it was ok for you. Also I think the hand on the bottom part of the card gives it some “movement”.
Waiting for your comments I will draw the pope.
Good evening!
Omar.
Ah…the ring isn’t like this, it’s just a sketch!


You’re the best!
I will think about the cardinal tonight and tell you tomorrow.
Something doesn’t convince me about the proportions of the face… the nose seems bent towards the left, you can’t see the mouth because it’s covered by the hand, but there seems to be too much distance between the nose and the hand.
The hand is fine, but it’s too over the edge; however it’s not a problem because I can change the proportions, you only have to colour 5mm more of the body.
GO ON!
THANK YOU as usual!
BYE,
Nicola


Good! I’m glad you’re satisfied, I’m really happy about how the assassin and the relic has come out, I really like it. The cardinal has a weird face, you’re right. But I’m satisfied with the velvet effect and the facial expression: nasty pig…!

I would like to put the chair under the “nasty pig”, but I don’t want to make a mistake and discover at the end that the card is out of place. So leave him standing, maybe rotate the hand 45° in an anti-clockwise direction because there is the risk of an unnatural position.

Hi Nicola, here is the correct cardinal, it was a hard job but now it’s ok. Look at it and let me know. Omar

IT’S PERFECT, I just meant you to leave the hand as it is, cut it, rotate it and paste it, I didn’t mean you to redraw the whole part.
I will write it better next time, Italian is too interpretable 
THANK YOU, you always do the best.


Some steps:
Immagine
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EMPIRE CARDS: THE HEROINE

Messaggio da leggereda Veldriss il 3 luglio 2016, 17:28

I’m not convinced of making the HEROINE a woman, maybe HERO is better, but it would be a Joan of Arc fifty years earlier, so it can be done.
She should have bright colours, like the LEADER
An active pose with 04sword or maybe a 01pose
No shield
No heraldic symbol
Yes for the armour
No helmet, maybe two plaits like in picture 04
Then I was thinking (if it’s possible) of something such as an “inspiring light from above” such as picture 01 or 03, 05, but remember that these drawings have to be easily cut.

Immagine

Here is the idea of the heroine.
I think it’s right. I thought about the idea of putting a touch of “divinely inspired soldier” into it, but the lights and the clouds don’t convince me.
I didn’t like the idea of her kneeling, as if waiting for a blessing or in prayer.
So I thought about this pose: I think it has everything, concentration before a battle, feminine elegance, the strength of a warrior, and holding the sword like that seems like she’s communicating with a divine entity, asking for the strength, and underlining the fact that she’s on a mission, not working as a soldier.
Waiting for news,
Have a nice weekend
Omar


hi Nicola,
I was colouring the heroine, but I remembered that I hadn’t shown you the last version of the drawing. Tell me as soon as possible if you like it or if you want to change something, meanwhile I’ll start colouring it.
Bye,
Omar


Hi Omar,
The chest is ok, but I would eliminate the “rolls of fat” above the belt (unless you need them for the dress or the colour) and if you could widen the hips a bit, to make her more “woman” (she seems too straight now), but without exaggerating, she mustn’t be a SEXY HEROINE.
The rest is ok.
THANK YOU
Bye
Ps. I’m leaving for a convention in Padova tomorrow, I have an important convention in Pisa the 12th-13th of June, but don’t work in a hurry.


Hi Nicola
you have a good eye.
I wasn’t really convinced about that area either.
I had some problems with it.
The “fat” wasn’t really fat but the folds of the dress, I wanted to give the idea of a medieval dress, not one of those pictures where the characters seem straight out of a dressing room. I want to keep the medieval unkept style, but the folds were too round, it seemed fat.
The hips were narrow to give her a girlish air as she is quite young.
Here is the modified version, this is a lot better, let me know.
Bye.
Omar


Yes, I called it “fat” even though it wasn’t :)
Now it’s better, the HEROINE is approved!


I’m not convinced about the blue you used with the brown of the cloak…it’s also true that we can always change the colours as you’ve saved everything on different layers…like the RED LEADER, maybe in the end I will prefer that one.
Here is a BLUE HEROINE
I’ll prepare the next characters.
Bye, Nicola


Ok, the blue cloak actually looks better.
I noticed that the files you gave me to print are in RGB, I don’t know if you’ve been told but you must work in CMYK because in RGB the colours are fluorescent, totally different from the final print.
I sometimes send you the files in RGB, but it’s just because they aren’t so heavy and the quality is similar. They are made in CMYK and converted at the end.


So what must I do, must I change the files into CMYK and send them back or will you do that? I make the software do it, so I presume that the result with your program is the same.

yes, I can do it without any problems. The advice was simply so you could see the final colours while you were working, otherwise the shades of colour change when they are printed, and you weren’t expecting it.

Here are some steps:
Immagine

Maybe the one with the brown cloak is the best, what do you think? ;)
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EMPIRE CARDS: THE POPE

Messaggio da leggereda Veldriss il 3 luglio 2016, 17:28

The pope was discussed at phone...

Immagine
This is the best clothing…the cap MUST be the one that was used in that period.
If you want, this is CLEMENTE IV’s face:
Immagine
Popes in the XIII century don’t have a beard.


Pope: thin face, quite old and menacing.

Pope ok, but the stick must be vertical so it doesn’t go near the head.

Hi Nicola, here is the finished Pope.
Let me know when you can come and explain other drawings,
Bye,
Omar


Some steps:
Immagine
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EMPIRE CARDS: RELIC

Messaggio da leggereda Veldriss il 3 luglio 2016, 17:29

My old relic is a skeleton with clothes on…I don’t know if you can think of something original…otherwise we could think of the Graal or the Sindone…think about it :D
Immagine

The relic is harder to do, I thought about it a lot because I didn’t want to draw a standing dead person like in the old cards, I wanted a bust, a character. If I only drew a sheet or a reliquary I was going out of theme, so I thought of a character with his back towards us (a monk or a ospitaliero) that holds the reliquary religiously in his hands. The relic must be the main part of the card, not the figure, and the colours will help me do this.

Relic OK, I suggest the monk.

I was trying to put all the images in the cards…I think we have a problem with the relic…the monk seems to be smaller than the other characters, or I’m going to have to move it upwards to maintain the proportions with the other cards…I think you’ll have to lower the monk’s arms and, IF you can, move the relic a bit further from the monk’s body, so the image is widened a bit…otherwise it’s not like the other cards.

Some steps:
Immagine
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EMPIRE CARDS: THE ASSASSIN

Messaggio da leggereda Veldriss il 3 luglio 2016, 17:30

The assassin must be part of the sect of the NAZARITES…the image here is perfect…of course you mustn’t see the victim on the card, only the assassin.
Immagine

Goodmorning Nicola,
For the assassin, I have no problem putting the symbol on the belt (the assassin’s symbol printed in a corner), I you prefer it like that it’s practically already done, it will take me a short time to do it. As I’ve already told you, it seems too similar to the one I’m attaching, do you think it’s not a problem? Maybe I could reflect it horizontally. I’ve changed it a bit, what do you say?


Assassin: n.1 is the one we had decided, but I wanted to change it a bit, I didn’t want it to be like a picture already circulating. N.2 (apart from the face which is wrong, it will be like the one I have drawn next to it) I tried to study it so that it would communicate something, with the bloody knife and parchment (where I will put the symbol of the Nazarites) that represent the mission and the homicide contract.

Assassin…both are good, the ideal would be to unite them in a single drawing, for example the first one with the contract with the contract and the symbol in the belt…or only the symbol.
Or if it’s too difficult, the second one is better with the contract and the symbol and the bloody knife… (even though in the game not always the mission is accomplished.)
The symbol absolutely yes.


Ok for everything, the reflection and the contract+symbol in the belt.

Some steps:
Immagine

I don’t know if you notice the symbol of the Nazarites on the parchment…these are the real details :D
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